It's all in the details

kithunter

Elite Hunter
in helping some members getting ready for the con and seeing some of the recent works done on the forum something has begun to stick out that i wanted to address..

the details of the suit....

ok WTF do you mean andrew?.....

the small details of making your suit that much more "realistic looking" it's pretty basic items but i'm still seeing being missed on some builds. All these thoughts are just my opinion and not gospel


1st of all veining on your paint ups...it should be the base layer for your skin..it doesn't need to look like bane,.. but it should add that much more realism to your skin.

2nd staying with the bodysuit is the netting. it shouldn't be perfect..matter of fact the more worn and weathered the netting looks the better.


moving on to the armor:

i'm seeing lots of cool armor being done and it looks perfect...and that is just it...it's too perfect. A pred should have weatherd and battle scarred armor, if it's silver or copper ...for silver add some black washes to it and some blast marks,,,.. it's fairly easy and again it adds depth to the suit.
if it's copper it should have some patnia and shades of darker copper to it.

bios, leg armor,Gauntlets, backpacks, cannons all of it


same thing i'm seeing in some of the props and skulls etc ....

i know we all work hard on perfecting the pieces and sometimes it's hard to wanna dirty them up and they are better showcased on the suits when they aren't weathered. again just some food for thought as we are all getting ready for the holidays
weather and bloddy those pieces up..

and last moving like a predator...watch P1 and P2...pose in your suit and get the little mannerisms down.

KPH did so much in acting through the suit...it takes some practice so you don't look like a static prop...just somthing as simple as how you open your fingers ...trust me it adds the final touch..

we work hard on the suits, learn how to act and project through your costume.


Peace

Andrew
 

Skullsplitter

Elite Hunter
IMO each of should make what they like best.

That being said: IMO stuff should be made perfect and then beaten into bits, show some wear and tear across, and some small details like veins and paterns, scars and wounds/burns make a suit all the more credible.

If I recall correctly, the triceratops in Jurassic Park was quite brightly painted, and somebody thought "Doesn't quite look right" and hosed it down and threw some soil on the creature. While the painter later whiped off half of it, it made the creature look immensely real.
Not saying you have to, but it is what made the classic pred more lifelike than the more recent ones.
 

troggs

Hunter
Thanks Andrew, I'm trawling the site at the moment in preparation for starting my suit after halloween, the veining is something I definitely would not have thought of, the armour I have already started, now i can relax a bit with it, I've been so careful with the foam, now any damage can look deliberate.
 

kithunter

Elite Hunter
no problem guys if the post makes you think about it,... then it was worth it.

think of the suit in 2 ways: layers and overall look

if you break it down like that you'll start to see things in a different light...remember a predator shouldn't be "perfect"



AM
 

NeoKazama

Hunter
Great topic Kit, this are my two cents:

A few weeks ago I contacted Steve Wang and I show him the pics of my suit and i asked him for suggestions for it. His answer was that i need it to work on mottering, and well of course i asked him what the heck he meant by that, and he gave me a great example as an answer, look at the palm of your hand. is not a only one color, you can see little red and pink dots on it, maybe green for the veins and everything is layered one color on top of another.

So it make me think about make my paint ups better and focus in that realism.

Chris
 

yoslvr442

Blooded
very well said. i believe in weathering and worn. it certainly adds depth and realness to anything. My clones, i weathered the heck out of them. im sure my pred wont be any different. Preds are a creature of battle and choas. They should be dirty, worn, not perfect. if they were perfect then they wouldnt be a pred. The only time i could see a pred being a little more clean is when they are at trials. thats when they are just starting out in their life of hunting.
 

Bovine13

Hunter
Your speaking my language! The beauty is in the details has been my soapbox since I came here. If you want something to look real and believeable then you have to give it that life. Anything out in the world will get damaged, dirty, used and abused, battered, and effected by its surroundings. From a minor degree to the tenth circle of hell and back. You cant roll up into battle saying what a badass you are and look how tough I look...with the tags still on your armor and your weapons still covered in cosmolene.
 

TuaCathach

Hunter
this is something i have been saying to the guys for a while.. i see so many people putting so much time and effort into something only to be let down by i suppose the finishing touches.... not just with the preds but with other things to..

from my own perspective i try to make things as real as i can.. with flesh hunter .. real leather, real chainmaile real furs.. and to me they added to the build... it will be the same with my P2 elder build.. its the smaller details that either make or break a great suit..

another example would be Mcguyvers Mr I build.. wow .. i was blown away by it.. the guy took his time. didn't settle and say yea that looks ok.. i've seen some terrible ones then aswell.. were they were literally thrown together..

as i've just said.. its the small finer details that count..
 

PredatrHuntr

Veteran Hunter
EXCELLENT points Andrew! I remember when I got my first Bio and how I just painted it silver...that was it. Then I started seeing some kick ass paint ups - and they were ALL weathered and worn to look like they had seen years of battle. So I made it my mission to try and replicate that on all the Bios I paint. I still like a clean undamaged Bio every now and then, but it still has to have layers of paint to properly mimic the metallic look.

And I agree with the netting - it should look battered and a little torn...just like on your Elder suit...
 

Elkman

Blooded
I stand guilty as charged on this one. I never even got around to doing the veining on my Mr. Incredible suit, and the little pom-poms were such a hassle to deal with that I didn't even bother putting the bumps in there.

Also, let's talk about costume durability. My netting was coming apart after the Dragon*Con parade, so I didn't even bother with it for the rest of the weekend. And the stupid codpiece has given me nothing but problems. The ties ripped through the leather breechcloth because I didn't realize that the leather wouldn't stand up to it, so there are a bunch of pictures from Dragon*Con with the damn thing falling off. I finally put a backing behind it to give the leather some strength. Even with that, the stupid thing BROKE last weekend at the hunt in Champlin. I'm coming to the conclusion that using Sintra for armor is no longer acceptable. Not only is it fragile, there's no way to put detail into it.

The unwashed masses don't notice there are inaccuracies or lack of detail in a suit, but I've noticed all the problems. It sounds like other people around here are noticing them as well.
 

munson

Hunter
Excellent topic and points Andrew!

"Realism" is one of the main reasons why I repainted my Flusher Bio. When I looked at it, and them looked at other Flusher bios, it just didn't look "real" enough to me. Thankfully I had the help of some very experienced members that helped point me in the right direction. This will also help in the armor when I get to it as well.

haha, realistic effect also made me try something new as well. I'm using suede to get the effect of an animal hyde. Trying to make it look "realistic", I too the pieces I'm going to uses, went outside, soaked it in rain water [it was raining out] drug it under my foot on the sidewalk, scratched rock over it, put my lighter up to it, etc...all to try and get the realistic effect.

But, thanks again for the reminder that a lot of what takes a suit to the "next level" is the added details.

EDIT: now that I look at it, I can really see this being a very helpful thread and reminder in suit building. Could it possibly be pinned up in one of the sections for suit building?
 

kithunter

Elite Hunter
I'm coming to the conclusion that using Sintra for armor is no longer acceptable.
maybe if you spay mount foamies cut to the shape of the armor to the back of the armor it will provide better support as well as protect your suit/netting from getting any damage.

it's helped a few in the past.


all ideas and input in the thread are welcome.....feel free to add what has worked for you.
 

tusky

Hunter
All good points Andrew and a great thread. :)
When i made my 1st suit back when P2 was fairly,... recent, i spend hours watching the way KPH moved looked, paused the whole works.
I would practice in front of the mirror.
The slow rise from the crouch, snapping the head around with the dreads flying.
Staring at somebody then tilting the head to the side and slowly walking around them (sizing up the prey)
The classic arms extended to the sides head forward for the roar (screech).

I used to make people cautious when you don't say aword and just prowl around
Wife thought(knew) iwas nuts, but it worked.
Study the way the character should or would move.
Use your enviroment if you can.

Details to your costume can bring it to life also.
I call them "Barnacles" as they are the last thing to go on your suit.
Scratches, dents, bits of blood andor small adornments.
A great example is the Elder/ Grey back from P2, perfect suit in every way.

These things can make a good costume great
 

Mr Fett

Elite Hunter
Great post! I've always weathered down my Pred armor parts, because I originated out of Star Wars costuming, and everything in that movie universe is weathered and worn looking.

As far as movement in a Pred suit, I try to move like Kithunter, which means walking on the ground and staying out of trees.
 
What a great thread. Its true that we get so caught up on getting our suits done that we miss the little things that add to the depth of the character like necklaces, trophies, netting etc etc. The movement in the suit is what does it for me, im currently studying KPH every chance I get so I can try and do some justice.
 
I love details too.
But... who are we making the details for? I had my sister over and I was sitting by the comp reading this forum. I started reading a thread with a guy that finished his P1 suit and my sister leaned over and looked at the suit. I asked her if she thought it looked good. She answered yes (because it really really really looked good). I told her it was a P1 suit. Then I scrolled down and a new picture comes up with the same guy taking his bio off. Then my sister asks: And what suit is that?

..... :)

If you just suddenly stopped all your motions for a second, you got the same reaction I did. He only took his bio off, and she didnt even notice it was the same suit (damn you infidel!)
So where am I going with this? Im not saying I dont care for details in suits, quite the opposite - I love details and they really make a suit look better and more real and that applys not only for suits, but art and everything else. But for the untrained eye, they more likely dont mean so much or even get noticed... which is sad in that term when the creator more then likely have spend hours and months and maybe even years on a suit to get it right.
So who are we making the suit for? Ourself, fans, or the mass of people in various places? A more detailed suit will always look better then a non-detailed, but will the "normal" beholder notice it?

Sorry if this post sounded gloomy, that was not excactly the intention... not sure what the intention was... but just have a thought of whom you making all the details for. Or something...
:D


Go Predators! ;)
 

kithunter

Elite Hunter
it's a legit question who are we building/detailing it for.

we build for ourselves.... these are our versions of the hunter...

i never did anything to please anyone else's sense of what looks good. i want my suit to look as good and real as it can.
it's the same reason i collect props and build suits...... for me

while we are here to share what we love, this hobby is a very personal thing for all of us.
 
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